Uber wants bicycles and scooters that can drive themselves to recharge

Recharging is a significant cost for electric scooter and bike companies.

Read the whole story

 

[scooterstudy]

Firstly I'm a huge fan of scooter. Mostly e scoot or kick.

secondly, Let's see! what uber do with it.

thirdly, lets people take it easily or not.

 

[naris48]

It seems like the biggest problem here would be the expense and weight of fitting each unit with the sensing and computing hardware that's required for self-driving anything. I am pretty sure that these companies use incredibly cheap bikes and scooters and still they struggle to turn a profit.

You might get away with cheapo off-the-shelf cell phone cameras and no LIDAR, since the speeds and overall risk are lower, but still the computing hardware seems tricky. Self-balancing is not computationally expensive, but self-driving is. Maybe they could keep the simple low-latency stuff like the balancing in on-board hardware and run the more expensive stuff in the cloud.

Another expense: hardware to keep the things upright when they stop. Good luck with all that.

Perhaps for scooters -- but who pedals the autonomous bicycles?

 

[Violynne]

Not sure how I will recoup my millions in R&D but YOLO

Digital ads on the carts!

To the article: I'm wiping my keyboard off. I spit my Coke Zero out.

 

[chriskrum]

So, for those of you who've been in cities with these scooter programs, and are familiar with all the stupid places they get abandoned by thoughtless people, now imagine those same locations being the starting point for a less-than-bright self driving scooter. I'm thinking about the 3rd floor of a parking garage myself at the moment.

I think I'd rather avoid tripping over them lying there than dodge them trying to weave their way through an urban environment back to a charging station.

A San Diego company named Scootscoop picks them up for free. They store them and
I assume Bird or Lyft can get back the scooters back for a fee.

I'm sure some nice, thoughtful, and considerate people use the scooters. But man, the rest of people ruin it for everybody. Just leave them in the dumbest places without a second thought. I'd rather they didn't wander around on their own after that trying to find home.

I'm really amazed that people keep saying this with a straight face, completely oblivious to the fact that you could make this statement equally accurately about cars and the people who drive them. For example, all of these cars are parked in a bike lane without a second thought:

You see the construction in the left side of your image? You're being played for a fool with this picture. It's likely they've shut down a lane and shifted traffic and parking which the guy who took the picture knows but left off-frame.

 

[agpob]

Oh this is great. Cyclists on the pavement, going the wrong way down roads, going through red lights, hitting pedestrians that they think are trespassing on their cyclepath and scraping cars while filtering.
And now we're going to have riderless bicycles doing all of that.

That's your brain remembering the one shitty cyclist you've encountered, and forgetting about 10 others that were courteous. Just like cyclists only remember the Dodge redneck who threw a beer bottle at them, and then judge all drivers poorly.

Besides, we are discussing tech here, and your complaint is a people complaint.

It only takes one turd to ruin the punchbowl.

But technology wise. Given the amount of hardware and software needed direct a car. Wouldn't this be even worse for a smaller more mobile vehicle. You're adding more weight and power draw. Especially given the amount of obstructions bikes encounter. Things in the bike lane, random drivers with vendettas or just ignore road rules, and all the things cars have to concern themselves over too. I feel like self driving bikes would come after cars from a hardware perspective.

Too many unknown & unknowable variables. Commercial aircraft that can fully perform a complete flight without human intervention operates in a much more highly regulated, standardized environment. Without such strict uniformity & common standards on the ground, and a more secure software/cloud environment, AI operated vehicles can not fulfill their mission.

 

[LesDawg]

I have a bicycle. And I constantly encounter bad behaviour by cyclists. It's not just anecdotal either; efforts to get more women riding bicycles in the UK have come up against the behaviour of male cyclists putting them off. The reaction I get when I slow down and stop for elderly people, women with buggies, and dogs, suggests that for many people polite behaviour by cyclists is the exception.

I went to graduate school in Davis, California, a college town which, at the time, had 25,000 residents and over 40,000 bicycles. It's widely recognized as one of the most bike-friendly (and bike-dependent) cities in America. I loved my time (and my bike's time) there.

Every fall, a new crop of incoming freshmen would mean a fresh wave of bicycle-related *ssholery: riding on the wrong side of the street, running stop lights and signs, failing to yield to pedestrians or to cars or other bicyclists with the right of way, riding in the dark without lights, riding on sidewalks; you name it. If it was stupid and could be done on a bike, you could watch it happening every day in September.

Happily, the peak of this annual crime wave never lasted much more than about a month, after which it would die down and everybody in town was once again riding right. The reason: the city invested heavily in bicycle cops on fast bikes powered by well-toned muscles. They were as serious as a heart attack about enforcing the traffic laws that bicyclists are required to abide by. Problem solved.

For me, the highlight of this annual city-wide learning experience was watching some new kid decide that he didn't need to pull over when ordered to do so, figuring that an eighteen year-old should be able to outrun a thirty-something bike cop. Wrong. Those cops, riding 8 hour shifts every workday, were in peak condition, riding primo bikes, and were highly trained in great moves for taking down a cyclist who refused to stop. It wasn't pretty, but damn it was funny.

 

[WiseGuy7]

I will invest in a company who can build a robot politician. Is that even allowed in constitution ?

 

[Eurynom0s]

So, for those of you who've been in cities with these scooter programs, and are familiar with all the stupid places they get abandoned by thoughtless people, now imagine those same locations being the starting point for a less-than-bright self driving scooter. I'm thinking about the 3rd floor of a parking garage myself at the moment.

I think I'd rather avoid tripping over them lying there than dodge them trying to weave their way through an urban environment back to a charging station.

A San Diego company named Scootscoop picks them up for free. They store them and
I assume Bird or Lyft can get back the scooters back for a fee.

I'm sure some nice, thoughtful, and considerate people use the scooters. But man, the rest of people ruin it for everybody. Just leave them in the dumbest places without a second thought. I'd rather they didn't wander around on their own after that trying to find home.

I'm really amazed that people keep saying this with a straight face, completely oblivious to the fact that you could make this statement equally accurately about cars and the people who drive them. For example, all of these cars are parked in a bike lane without a second thought:

You see the construction in the left side of your image? You're being played for a fool with this picture. It's likely they've shut down a lane and shifted traffic and parking which the guy who took the picture knows but left off-frame.

https://laist.com/2018/10/19/essay_biki ... ngeles.php

Taken myself over the weekend:

Parking in bike lanes is rampant and I'm sure you know it.

 

[mmiller7]

So, for those of you who've been in cities with these scooter programs, and are familiar with all the stupid places they get abandoned by thoughtless people, now imagine those same locations being the starting point for a less-than-bright self driving scooter. I'm thinking about the 3rd floor of a parking garage myself at the moment.

I think I'd rather avoid tripping over them lying there than dodge them trying to weave their way through an urban environment back to a charging station.

Hmm. I'm moderately in favour of this idea. Before you downvote me, hear me out. No-one's suggesting that a cycle be able to manoeuvre itself from the 3rd floor of a garage. I'm thinking of a very limited form of autonomy - something like:

- You leave the bike somewhere it recognises and is able to safely steer itself elsewhere - e.g. by the side of a dedicated cyclepath - you get 30% off the rental fee.

- You leave the bike somewhere it can't orientate itself or where it's not safe for it to move itself - you pay full rental fee. A staffer or subcontractor will come get the bike if it's not rented out again soonish.

- You find a bike somewhere it can't safely move itself (eg on the 3rd floor of a garage) and move it to a cycle path and let it go off on its way. You get 30% off your next rental or maybe a cash bonus if it was somewhere truly out of the way. This encourages and rewards people to be more tidy with the bikes.

I think in a few years time, a form of slow-moving, strictly limited, safe-ish autonomy is quite achievable within the cost and power budget of a rentable bike or scooter. Cheap $20 smartwatches and $20 flying drones are already outfitted with low budget sensors, accelerometers, cameras, radios, self-stabilising, internet-connected and control tech and so on.

Where are you finding that?

Even a basic USB webcam runs around $10...the $50 drone I got to play with last year still wasn't fancy enough to have any cameras.

 

[ten91]

Oh this is great. Cyclists on the pavement, going the wrong way down roads, going through red lights, hitting pedestrians that they think are trespassing on their cyclepath and scraping cars while filtering.
And now we're going to have riderless bicycles doing all of that.

That's your brain remembering the one shitty cyclist you've encountered, and forgetting about 10 others that were courteous. Just like cyclists only remember the Dodge redneck who threw a beer bottle at them, and then judge all drivers poorly.

Besides, we are discussing tech here, and your complaint is a people complaint.

It only takes one turd to ruin the punchbowl.

But technology wise. Given the amount of hardware and software needed direct a car. Wouldn't this be even worse for a smaller more mobile vehicle. You're adding more weight and power draw. Especially given the amount of obstructions bikes encounter. Things in the bike lane, random drivers with vendettas or just ignore road rules, and all the things cars have to concern themselves over too. I feel like self driving bikes would come after cars from a hardware perspective.

Too many unknown & unknowable variables. Commercial aircraft that can fully perform a complete flight without human intervention operates in a much more highly regulated, standardized environment. Without such strict uniformity & common standards on the ground, and a more secure software/cloud environment, AI operated vehicles can not fulfill their mission.

Also planes are possibly one of the easiest autopilots to design. All it does is maintain a straight course at a level altitude. The plane isn't navigating itself, the pilot is just pointing it in a direction and telling it to keep going that way. The autopilot is making sure it stays on that course.

 

[mmiller7]

I will invest in a company who can build a robot politician. Is that even allowed in constitution ?

Haven't you seen the result on StarTrek of computer AI trying to process illogical inputs? It would self destruct the first hour in office!

 

[Dr Gitlin]

Oh this is great. Cyclists on the pavement, going the wrong way down roads, going through red lights, hitting pedestrians that they think are trespassing on their cyclepath and scraping cars while filtering.
And now we're going to have riderless bicycles doing all of that.

Actually, given the fact that 'non asshole behavior' (maybe that's robotics 4th law?) will be programmed into these things, they may serve to decrease the Rambo behavior on the streets. Rather like autonomous cars are programmed to be rather cautious, defensive drivers.

Didn't Uber disable emergency braking on their test cars just to improve the ride a bit?

I am not really feeling the trust here.

No, to be accurate it disabled the entire Volvo ADAS suite to avoid it intervening or confusing Uber's autonomous driving stack.

 

[ten91]

I will invest in a company who can build a robot politician. Is that even allowed in constitution ?

Haven't you seen the result on StarTrek of computer AI trying to process illogical inputs? It would self destruct the first hour in office!

Well the requirement of being at least 35yo would also be tricky too.

 

[TracerDX]

Randomly gluing trendy ideas together does not always equal profit.

 

[Dr Gitlin]

It seems like the biggest problem here would be the expense and weight of fitting each unit with the sensing and computing hardware that's required for self-driving anything. I am pretty sure that these companies use incredibly cheap bikes and scooters and still they struggle to turn a profit.

You might get away with cheapo off-the-shelf cell phone cameras and no LIDAR, since the speeds and overall risk are lower, but still the computing hardware seems tricky. Self-balancing is not computationally expensive, but self-driving is. Maybe they could keep the simple low-latency stuff like the balancing in on-board hardware and run the more expensive stuff in the cloud.

Another expense: hardware to keep the things upright when they stop. Good luck with all that.

I was thinking along the same lines. However, there are these little robot box delivery things where I live now that run on the sidewalks at walking speed, and give way to pedestrians pretty well. These things are really small (18" tall?), and definitely don't have advanced lidar domes and stuff like that.

I could imagine a bike that deploys some training wheels, and creeps along on sidewalks using the same kind of "autonomous pedestrian" technology. It doesn't have to be fast, it just has to be able to get from point A to point B on its own. At first blush I thought it was ridiculous for the reasons you name, but as I think about a bike that can creep slowly/safely along public sidewalks and pedestrian intersections, it starts to seem only half crazy to me..

If they train them anything like cyclists in DC then Uber won't need to program them to stop at red lights, or stop signs, or avoid pedestrians.

 

[dr-grep]

This sounds like the dumbest idea ever, unless you want to waste a gazillion dollars...

 

[Statistical]

Oh this is great. Cyclists on the pavement, going the wrong way down roads, going through red lights, hitting pedestrians that they think are trespassing on their cyclepath and scraping cars while filtering.
And now we're going to have riderless bicycles doing all of that.

That's your brain remembering the one shitty cyclist you've encountered, and forgetting about 10 others that were courteous. Just like cyclists only remember the Dodge redneck who threw a beer bottle at them, and then judge all drivers poorly.

Besides, we are discussing tech here, and your complaint is a people complaint.

It only takes one turd to ruin the punchbowl.

But technology wise. Given the amount of hardware and software needed direct a car. Wouldn't this be even worse for a smaller more mobile vehicle. You're adding more weight and power draw. Especially given the amount of obstructions bikes encounter. Things in the bike lane, random drivers with vendettas or just ignore road rules, and all the things cars have to concern themselves over too. I feel like self driving bikes would come after cars from a hardware perspective.

Too many unknown & unknowable variables. Commercial aircraft that can fully perform a complete flight without human intervention operates in a much more highly regulated, standardized environment. Without such strict uniformity & common standards on the ground, and a more secure software/cloud environment, AI operated vehicles can not fulfill their mission.

Also planes are possibly one of the easiest autopilots to design. All it does is maintain a straight course at a level altitude. The plane isn't navigating itself, the pilot is just pointing it in a direction and telling it to keep going that way. The autopilot is making sure it stays on that course.

Well modern aviation autopilot systems are a lot more capable. Most can handle complex multi waypoint routes and altitude adjustments. The most advanced systems are capable of automatic landing. The big difference is that even the most complex systems can just keep the attitude level and hand it back to the pilot if they have a problem a car can't just keep the speed and direction constant and hand it back to the driver.

 

[ubercurmudgeon]

So, for those of you who've been in cities with these scooter programs, and are familiar with all the stupid places they get abandoned by thoughtless people, now imagine those same locations being the starting point for a less-than-bright self driving scooter. I'm thinking about the 3rd floor of a parking garage myself at the moment.

How about just a corridor:

 

[redtomato]

So, for those of you who've been in cities with these scooter programs, and are familiar with all the stupid places they get abandoned by thoughtless people, now imagine those same locations being the starting point for a less-than-bright self driving scooter. I'm thinking about the 3rd floor of a parking garage myself at the moment.

I think I'd rather avoid tripping over them lying there than dodge them trying to weave their way through an urban environment back to a charging station.

Hmm. I'm moderately in favour of this idea. Before you downvote me, hear me out. No-one's suggesting that a cycle be able to manoeuvre itself from the 3rd floor of a garage. I'm thinking of a very limited form of autonomy - something like:

- You leave the bike somewhere it recognises and is able to safely steer itself elsewhere - e.g. by the side of a dedicated cyclepath - you get 30% off the rental fee.

- You leave the bike somewhere it can't orientate itself or where it's not safe for it to move itself - you pay full rental fee. A staffer or subcontractor will come get the bike if it's not rented out again soonish.

- You find a bike somewhere it can't safely move itself (eg on the 3rd floor of a garage) and move it to a cycle path and let it go off on its way. You get 30% off your next rental or maybe a cash bonus if it was somewhere truly out of the way. This encourages and rewards people to be more tidy with the bikes.

I think in a few years time, a form of slow-moving, strictly limited, safe-ish autonomy is quite achievable within the cost and power budget of a rentable bike or scooter. Cheap $20 smartwatches and $20 flying drones are already outfitted with low budget sensors, accelerometers, cameras, radios, self-stabilising, internet-connected and control tech and so on.

Where are you finding that?

Even a basic USB webcam runs around $10...the $50 drone I got to play with last year still wasn't fancy enough to have any cameras.

15 second search:
https://www.alibaba.com/product-detail/ ... 23382.html?

'quadcopter remote control drone rc camera drone with wifi'
Flying time about 5 min. Min order 1 piece. $15 - $30, I think depends on postage etc.

I wouldn't buy it, it's probably shit. But there's a whole lot of tech in there for $20-odd, and future models will be better.

 

[ten91]

Oh this is great. Cyclists on the pavement, going the wrong way down roads, going through red lights, hitting pedestrians that they think are trespassing on their cyclepath and scraping cars while filtering.
And now we're going to have riderless bicycles doing all of that.

That's your brain remembering the one shitty cyclist you've encountered, and forgetting about 10 others that were courteous. Just like cyclists only remember the Dodge redneck who threw a beer bottle at them, and then judge all drivers poorly.

Besides, we are discussing tech here, and your complaint is a people complaint.

It only takes one turd to ruin the punchbowl.

But technology wise. Given the amount of hardware and software needed direct a car. Wouldn't this be even worse for a smaller more mobile vehicle. You're adding more weight and power draw. Especially given the amount of obstructions bikes encounter. Things in the bike lane, random drivers with vendettas or just ignore road rules, and all the things cars have to concern themselves over too. I feel like self driving bikes would come after cars from a hardware perspective.

Too many unknown & unknowable variables. Commercial aircraft that can fully perform a complete flight without human intervention operates in a much more highly regulated, standardized environment. Without such strict uniformity & common standards on the ground, and a more secure software/cloud environment, AI operated vehicles can not fulfill their mission.

Also planes are possibly one of the easiest autopilots to design. All it does is maintain a straight course at a level altitude. The plane isn't navigating itself, the pilot is just pointing it in a direction and telling it to keep going that way. The autopilot is making sure it stays on that course.

Well modern aviation autopilot systems are a lot more capable. Most can handle complex multi waypoint routes and altitude adjustments. The most advanced systems are capable of automatic landing. The big difference is that even the most complex systems can just keep the attitude level and hand it back to the pilot if they have a problem a car can't just keep the speed and direction constant and hand it back to the driver.

Also you know well in advance where other planes will be. Not to mention you don't have to watch for pedestrians at 30,0000ft.

 

[onkeljonas]

I think in a few years time, a form of slow-moving, strictly limited, safe-ish autonomy is quite achievable within the cost and power budget of a rentable bike or scooter.

Slowmoving bikes aren't stable.

 

[Stasis007]

pay $5+ per, the unemployable or desperate idiots not so keen with math spend gas money & time scooping them all up, devaluing their car, risking accident, then electricity to charge & more costs to return, if their lucky theyll get 10 scooters if some other desperate soul out of hundreds all competeing for that precious $5 that probably costs them $4 & make $50 for their efforts

just know a few months ago it was $10 the brilliant magical self teaching algorithm needed to entice the plebs & just tests how low it can go, next month it'll be $4 a scooter

Lime Scooters in New Zealand operates like this. They "employ" an army of "juicers" as independent contractors to pick up the scooters after 9pm and take them home to charge. Juicers then return them to hotspots around the city by 6am and are paid $NZ7 per scooter ($US4.70). Juicers can also pick up low battery scooters at any time of the day, their app shows when a scooter is "harvestable". It's all locked down. You can't harvest a scooter through the app unless the conditions are correct. There are penalties for not sufficiently charging a scooter or returning it incorrectly.

I can tell you there's no shortage of (hungry) people here wanting in on this, and the potential projected savings seems hardly worth the effort of developing a fully automated process.

And Uber already has an army of contractors roaming the streets that would literally get in a punch-up for the chance to harvest a scooter or bike for a couple of extra dollars. This makes absolutely no sense at all to me. I'm guessing it's coming from a marketing standpoint, "Hey look everybody! We're super edgy and futuristic!"

 

[thegunner]

I feel like self-driving scooters, which would inherently have several hundred if not thousands of dollars of tech on-board, are gonna find themselves disappearing rapidly while out in the public domain.

Also, seems like you would need a *whole lot* of uses to recover the initial layout on each scooter.

 

[Fatesrider]

So, for those of you who've been in cities with these scooter programs, and are familiar with all the stupid places they get abandoned by thoughtless people, now imagine those same locations being the starting point for a less-than-bright self driving scooter. I'm thinking about the 3rd floor of a parking garage myself at the moment.

I think I'd rather avoid tripping over them lying there than dodge them trying to weave their way through an urban environment back to a charging station.

I'm thinking Lemmings, all flying off a cliff.

One badly timed CME, and that scenario has real-world probabilities.

 

[mrscrib]

So, for those of you who've been in cities with these scooter programs, and are familiar with all the stupid places they get abandoned by thoughtless people, now imagine those same locations being the starting point for a less-than-bright self driving scooter. I'm thinking about the 3rd floor of a parking garage myself at the moment.

I think I'd rather avoid tripping over them lying there than dodge them trying to weave their way through an urban environment back to a charging station.

Are you crazy? For those of us that like playing video games, life with self-driving scooters is the closest thing we'll get to a (survivable) platformer without getting into parkour.

Bring on the self-driving scooters!

 

[bvz_1]

So, for those of you who've been in cities with these scooter programs, and are familiar with all the stupid places they get abandoned by thoughtless people, now imagine those same locations being the starting point for a less-than-bright self driving scooter. I'm thinking about the 3rd floor of a parking garage myself at the moment.

I think I'd rather avoid tripping over them lying there than dodge them trying to weave their way through an urban environment back to a charging station.

On the flip side, imagine these scooters intelligently parking themselves out of the way of foot and driving traffic, no matter where one of the many morons who uses them just dumps them.

 

[xWidget]

So, for those of you who've been in cities with these scooter programs, and are familiar with all the stupid places they get abandoned by thoughtless people, now imagine those same locations being the starting point for a less-than-bright self driving scooter. I'm thinking about the 3rd floor of a parking garage myself at the moment.

I think I'd rather avoid tripping over them lying there than dodge them trying to weave their way through an urban environment back to a charging station.

A San Diego company named Scootscoop picks them up for free. They store them and
I assume Bird or Lyft can get back the scooters back for a fee.

Pretty sure that's more like holding them hostage.

I was wondering what authority they would use to simply take the scooters away, since e.g. parking your car in someone's driveway doesn't immediately make it theirs.

I think they're using normal towing laws for motorized vehicles? And it sounds like for the couple states I saw, if it's on residential property you can have cars towed immediately. California requires waiting one hour before towing.

Tbh I'd be interested to see a fight if someone brings a scooter left on their property inside and refuses to give it back.

 

[DaveSimmons]

Since it's Uber, this is what I expect to happen:

https://youtu.be/tGmRdm_oJFQ

and

https://youtu.be/HLBRmu3lLi0


(Maximum Overdrive, one of the best soundtrack CDs ever.)

 

[Peevester]

So, for those of you who've been in cities with these scooter programs, and are familiar with all the stupid places they get abandoned by thoughtless people, now imagine those same locations being the starting point for a less-than-bright self driving scooter. I'm thinking about the 3rd floor of a parking garage myself at the moment.

I think I'd rather avoid tripping over them lying there than dodge them trying to weave their way through an urban environment back to a charging station.

Thankfully we don't have these things in Chicago yet, or maybe not thankfully, because I would be strongly tempted to yoink a faraday cage over the control box of a bird scooter and make something fun out of the pieces.

What we do have are bike rentals (non-electric) where there are designated stands where you must pick up and leave the bikes (or you are charged a LOT for a continuing rental and can't take out another one), and I love the things. Even though I have my own bike, when I go downtown I often use the divvies instead, because it's not like you're going to go that fast on downtown streets anyway (though we also now have dedicated and protected bike lanes, which RULE), and they're "good enough", and not bad if you're looking for a workout anyway, because they're heavy. Heck, I rode one across from the loop to the Mag mile in December! It was way cheaper than a taxi or even transit because I have an unlimited yearly pass, which has more than paid for itself since I used the things about 100 times over the year.

Point is, it CAN be a good thing, you just need to actually spend the money on infrastructure and not be a raging dickhole like Bird seems to be.

A self-driven pickup and dropoff would be amazing, even if you didn't use the electric bits at any other time. The one bad thing about divvies is that the stations are at least a quarter-mile apart, so sometimes you still walk quite a bit.

 

[PandaCheese]

I think bicycles going down the street or sidewalk without anyone riding it will just make people think they are out of control...or the Second Coming is here.

 

[arsorb]

Would it not be easier to incentivise users to plug the bikes back in when they are finished? Either offer a discount on your account when the bike is connected to a charger or issue fines for not returning and charging the bike correctly.

Plug the bike in where? The entire business model is use the scooter and leave it wherever the hell you feel like (usually the street of sidewalk or wherever you are going). If these companies had to have scooter stations with racks and charging capabilities and you could only pickup or dropoff a scooter there the business wouldn't even exist.

Returning bikes to the rack is exactly how Citi-bikes work. Pick it up at the rack “near” your home and drop them off at the rack “near” your place of work. It’s a little inconvenient for the customer, but it’s way better than leaving them lying around. I agree that leaving them “wherever” uncharged is ridiculous, but they could set up racks/ charging stations to return these things to. Other companies already work that way.

I agree autonomous bikes and scooters are a solution looking for a problem as they say. Certainly it’s over complicated.

 

[dorkbert]

So they may need a self defense mechanism as well or at least a camera to record the vandal. Perhaps a little R2-D2 electric shock?

I am actually more thinking of Johnny Cab...

 

[pebird]

So, for those of you who've been in cities with these scooter programs, and are familiar with all the stupid places they get abandoned by thoughtless people, now imagine those same locations being the starting point for a less-than-bright self driving scooter. I'm thinking about the 3rd floor of a parking garage myself at the moment.

I think I'd rather avoid tripping over them lying there than dodge them trying to weave their way through an urban environment back to a charging station.

A San Diego company named Scootscoop picks them up for free. They store them and
I assume Bird or Lyft can get back the scooters back for a fee.

I'm sure some nice, thoughtful, and considerate people use the scooters. But man, the rest of people ruin it for everybody. Just leave them in the dumbest places without a second thought. I'd rather they didn't wander around on their own after that trying to find home.

I'm really amazed that people keep saying this with a straight face, completely oblivious to the fact that you could make this statement equally accurately about cars and the people who drive them. For example, all of these cars are parked in a bike lane without a second thought:

Thanks, never seen a bike lane with parking meters before.

 

[Fatesrider]

So, for those of you who've been in cities with these scooter programs, and are familiar with all the stupid places they get abandoned by thoughtless people, now imagine those same locations being the starting point for a less-than-bright self driving scooter. I'm thinking about the 3rd floor of a parking garage myself at the moment.

I think I'd rather avoid tripping over them lying there than dodge them trying to weave their way through an urban environment back to a charging station.

On the flip side, imagine these scooters intelligently parking themselves out of the way of foot and driving traffic, no matter where one of the many morons who uses them just dumps them.

He did: "I'd rather avoid tripping over them lying there than dodge them trying to weave their way through an urban environment back to a charging station."

Autonomous Scooters and such will not be intelligent ENOUGH to avoid running into people. Hell, AV's have difficulty with that, and they have a lot more equipment meant to detect that kind of thing.

It's the getting from where the morons dumped them to the "intelligently parking themselves out of the way of foot and driving traffic" part that's the problem you're overlooking. Unless you think that people won't be dumping them wherever and will accept them going into traffic (and staying on streets as opposed to sidewalks). Personally, I don't see that happening at all, since Bird and other such companies make it cheaper and easier to use, even if it can't steer itself.

In all honesty, I see this whole endeavor basically exploding and burning on the launch pad. It's a concept that isn't ready for prime time, if it ever will be.

 

[deus01]

Would it not be easier to incentivise users to plug the bikes back in when they are finished? Either offer a discount on your account when the bike is connected to a charger or issue fines for not returning and charging the bike correctly.

Plug the bike in where? The entire business model is use the scooter and leave it wherever the hell you feel like (usually the street of sidewalk or wherever you are going). If these companies had to have scooter stations with racks and charging capabilities and you could only pickup or dropoff a scooter there the business wouldn't even exist.

Returning bikes to the rack is exactly how Citi-bikes work. Pick it up at the rack “near” your home and drop them off at the rack “near” your place of work. It’s a little inconvenient for the customer, but it’s way better than leaving them lying around. I agree that leaving them “wherever” uncharged is ridiculous, but they could set up racks/ charging stations to return these things to. Other companies already work that way.

I agree autonomous bikes and scooters are a solution looking for a problem as they say. Certainly it’s over complicated.

When I first heard about these I couldn't believe that they didn't follow the Boris/Citi/Divvy bike model where you needed to return it to a station. It's crazy that you can just leave them anywhere and all I can say is that VC's are so stupid for blowing money funding stuff like this.

 

[Eurynom0s]

So, for those of you who've been in cities with these scooter programs, and are familiar with all the stupid places they get abandoned by thoughtless people, now imagine those same locations being the starting point for a less-than-bright self driving scooter. I'm thinking about the 3rd floor of a parking garage myself at the moment.

I think I'd rather avoid tripping over them lying there than dodge them trying to weave their way through an urban environment back to a charging station.

A San Diego company named Scootscoop picks them up for free. They store them and
I assume Bird or Lyft can get back the scooters back for a fee.

I'm sure some nice, thoughtful, and considerate people use the scooters. But man, the rest of people ruin it for everybody. Just leave them in the dumbest places without a second thought. I'd rather they didn't wander around on their own after that trying to find home.

I'm really amazed that people keep saying this with a straight face, completely oblivious to the fact that you could make this statement equally accurately about cars and the people who drive them. For example, all of these cars are parked in a bike lane without a second thought:

Thanks, never seen a bike lane with parking meters before.

There are lots of instances in Los Angeles of a bike lane getting put in and then it taking a long time for the meters to get removed. Although there is parking there...it's just not in the bike lane. Look at the picture again. There are clearly parking spots marked off just to the left of the parked cars.

Here's another example of where there IS parking, but it's clearly to the left of the bike lane...yet people maneuver in between the bollards anyhow.

You are CLEARLY not supposed to park there.

 

[gjvanoldenborgh]

Google solved this problem a few years ago. https://youtu.be/LSZPNwZex9s

 

[muzakof3]

So I can see the performance art of the future:

Bikedance! The street musical spectacular! 2000 bikes and scooters dance themselves into the night! They form the shape of every earth landmark. Bikedance! You don't want to miss it!

 

[Celery Man]

So, for those of you who've been in cities with these scooter programs, and are familiar with all the stupid places they get abandoned by thoughtless people, now imagine those same locations being the starting point for a less-than-bright self driving scooter. I'm thinking about the 3rd floor of a parking garage myself at the moment.

I think I'd rather avoid tripping over them lying there than dodge them trying to weave their way through an urban environment back to a charging station.

A San Diego company named Scootscoop picks them up for free. They store them and
I assume Bird or Lyft can get back the scooters back for a fee.

I'm sure some nice, thoughtful, and considerate people use the scooters. But man, the rest of people ruin it for everybody. Just leave them in the dumbest places without a second thought. I'd rather they didn't wander around on their own after that trying to find home.

I'm really amazed that people keep saying this with a straight face, completely oblivious to the fact that you could make this statement equally accurately about cars and the people who drive them. For example, all of these cars are parked in a bike lane without a second thought:

Thanks, never seen a bike lane with parking meters before.

There are lots of instances in Los Angeles of a bike lane getting put in and then it taking a long time for the meters to get removed. Although there is parking there...it's just not in the bike lane. Look at the picture again. There are clearly parking spots marked off just to the left of the parked cars.

Here's another example of where there IS parking, but it's clearly to the left of the bike lane...yet people maneuver in between the bollards anyhow.

You are CLEARLY not supposed to park there.

I wonder how many cars are going to get hit parking in the real spots until everyone adjusts...

 

[caesar7]

If you fail to make an autonomous car, what you do next -- create an autonomous scooter/bike! Brilliant