Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Leonard Horowitz (2nd nomination)

The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was delete. Secret ^account 18:00, 15 August 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Leonard Horowitz

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I first asked at WP:FTN because I thought that this person might be notable from a WP:FRINGEBLP perspective. However, the consensus there was that he was not.

Alternatively, we could argue he might be notable from a WP:AUTHOR perspective, but I think he clearly fails the criteria there.

Finally, we could ask whether he is notable from a WP:PROF perspective. Again, it seems clear that he is not.

I cannot find a biographical criteria by which he is notable. Basically, he is used as a reference by the anti-vaccine or AIDS conspiracy theory community probably because of his nominal medical training. But mere mention of a person is not grounds for notability here. There needs to be significant coverage of the person as a person for a biography to be possible. The previous AfD's !Keep rationales don't to me indicate any good reasons to have a WP:BLP for the person and the fact that the article has had tagged problems for nearly half a decade seems to me to say that its problems are not solvable (probably because sources simply are not forthcoming).

I believe that the situation is such that we don't have good reason to keep this article. His lack of notability furthermore hampers any attempt to create WP:NPOV and reasonable evaluation of the content. Some preference a default to delete mindset for biographies and I would say that this is a prime example where such an instinct could be quite helpful. jps (talk) 12:11, 8 August 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This debate has been included in the list of United States of America-related deletion discussions. • Gene93k (talk) 15:33, 8 August 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This debate has been included in the list of Conspiracy theories-related deletion discussions. • Gene93k (talk) 15:33, 8 August 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This debate has been included in the list of Medicine-related deletion discussions. • Gene93k (talk) 15:33, 8 August 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This debate has been included in the list of Actors and filmmakers-related deletion discussions. • Gene93k (talk) 15:33, 8 August 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This debate has been included in the list of Authors-related deletion discussions. • Gene93k (talk) 15:33, 8 August 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Delete. Just not seeing evidence the subject meets notability under any of the above mentioned categories. I am open to hearing discussion and seeing sources. - - MrBill3 (talk) 08:20, 9 August 2014 (UTC)[reply]
Delete. Fails WP:BLPFRINGE. I am not able to find significant coverage of the subject in reliable sources independent of the subject. The article appears to exploit tenuous links (i.e. trivial mentions) between Horowitz and Kimberly Bergalis as well as Horowitz and the Jeremiah Wright controversy as a backdoor approach to notability. The bulk of the article is built upon either primary source information or information that does not mention Horowitz. I do not have a strong objection to redirecting to Discredited HIV/AIDS origins theories#Purported intentional creation. Location (talk) 09:02, 10 August 2014 (UTC) [Edited 15:27, 14 August 2014 (UTC).][reply]

* Keep notable author and producer. Also possible discoverer of the true origins of HIV.

Quote: It may be of interest to some that in 1996 Dr Leonard G Horowitz of Harvard, (DMD, MA, MPH) published his award-winning, best-seller: “EMERGING VIRUSES-AIDS and EBOLA-Nature, Accident or Intentional”. After exhaustive research of stunning scientific documents, Dr Horowitz claims that during the 60s the American National Cancer Institute, researchers mixed viral genes from different animals “to produce leukemia, sarcoma, general wasting and death”. See Al-Ahram Weekley. He is the author of the best seller EMERGING VIRUSES-AIDS and EBOLA-Nature, Accident or Intentional. This should not even be up for deletion review. (Boss Reality (talk) 10:40, 14 August 2014 (UTC)[reply]

)

Delete Boss Reality convinced me... --Randykitty (talk) 14:07, 14 August 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Reply to Randykitty, :) :), somehow I had a feeling that you would jump on what I said. But what are your own thoughts ?

Delete - seems to fail WP:BLPFRINGE and WP:SIGCOV, among other policies and guidelines. WegianWarrior (talk) 15:21, 14 August 2014 (UTC)[reply]
Comment - Dr Leonard Horwitz, Bestselling author and winner of Author of the year award 1999 by World Natural Health Organization. Author of over 12 books including Emerging Viruses: AIDS And Ebola : Nature, Accident or Intentional? was a bestseller.
Customer Reviews of Emerging Viruses: AIDS And Ebola : Nature, Accident or Intentional?
Dr. Leonard G. Horowitz's national best-seller (that the New York Times refused to review) provides the first in-depth exploration into the origins of HIV and Ebola [1]
A range of reviews See all 47 customer reviews (newest first) >
Just a snippet here where the reviewer R. Wood says Quote: "Interestingly, the bad reviewers of this book have only convinced me of its accuracy. None of their criticisms strike me as being sound. A few of them criticize the book for scaring people" Sourced from Amazon.
Now, I'm not in any way trying to use this to validate the book or the author. All I'm doing is using an example of a reviewers observation of reactions to new and challenging information.
Award winner: 1999 “Author of the Year Award” from the World Natural Health Organization. The Spectrum MAY 8, 2001 Page 57 (Boss Reality (talk))
Further Comment:, Isn't Dr Leonard Horowitz a film maker as well. His list includes >> Talk Show Host, >> Author, >> Filmmaker, >> Music Producer, >> Public Health Authority, >> Emerging Diseases Researcher, >> Intellectual, >> Entreprenuer, >> Keynote Speaker, >> Investigative Reporter, >> Writer, >> Knight's Hospitaller, >> Health Educator, >> Activist, >> Counselor, >> Healer. I guess some of what he does may tread on the toes and sensibilites of others. (Boss Reality (talk) 23:03, 14 August 2014 (UTC))[reply]
~~More coverage out there in newsland~~
>> Article from the Al-Ahram Weekly Issue No.1208, 7 August, 2014 by reporter Not Ebola too Lubna Abdel Aziz .... Article: "Not Ebola Too", View article
>> Article from The Daily Mirror Jul 29, 2014 14:16 by reporter By Patrick Mulchrone .... Article: "Ebola conspiracy theories spreading fast as outbreak travels round globe - was deadly virus created in laboratory?", View article
>> Article from iciLome.com [8/14/2014 3:12:49 AM] - Petition à l'union Africaine - Afrique - PETITION A L’UNION AFRICAINE POUR UNE COMMISSION D’ENQUETE INTERNATIONALE DU CONSEIL DE SECURITE DE L’ONU ET DE L’UNION AFRICAINE SUR L’ORIGINE DU SIDA ET DE L’EBOLA Proposée par le Professeur Pascal ADJAMAGBO - View article
>> Article from Yahoo News Romania De redactia@bursa.ro (Redactia Bursa) | bursa.ro – Mi, 6 aug. 2014 "Ebola - o armă biologică, creată în laborator?" - View Article
>> Article from Sexenio 03 de agosto de 2014, Article: "El ébola ¿realidad o conspiración en África?" 03 de agosto de 2014 por Sergio Noriega Sección Lifestyle View article
>>> Article from The SPECTRUM MAY 8, 2001 View article MAY 8, 2001
>>> Article from The SPECTRUM NEWS RELEASE April 16, 2001 Page 47 NEWS RELEASE April 16, 2001 View article NEWS RELEASE April 16, 2001
There's more out there. The fact that with what's happening today, Dr Leonard Horowitz is now quoted in more than passing in current events around the world from England to The United States to Romania to Africa proves he is highly notable and the reasons for his nomination for deletion are without any foundation. Dr HOrowitz is a highly notable figure. He's a best selling and award winning author. This is beyond a doubt. And there are more news articles than what I've put in here. (Boss Reality (talk) 09:38, 15 August 2014 (UTC))[reply]
~~Better to keep~~ this article as there is more in the news than I have popped in here. Let's improve the article and work together on it please. It would be a very bad idea to destroy this article. Let's work together to improve and make it the great article it deserves. Thanks (Boss Reality (talk) 11:10, 15 August 2014 (UTC))[reply]
- Question Is there any evidence that his self-published book Emerging Viruses: AIDS And Ebola : Nature, Accident or Intentional?" was actually a best-seller? I can't find any. [2] isn't a reliable source for this. Amazon ranks it at "Amazon Best Sellers Rank: #69,389 in Books" - hardly a best seller unless you have a very narrow category. And the award mentioned is a trivial award from a non-notable organisation. Unless there's another one I missed. Dougweller (talk) 11:21, 15 August 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Not convinced by the sources listed above, either. --Randykitty (talk) 11:51, 15 August 2014 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.