Talk:List of Scottish inventions and discoveries

Edit

I have edited the section on Radar to include Henry Tizard who can equally be considered just as important to its development ,i also struck out the Phrase "other Scottish Royal Marines" in the Military section because clearly there is no such thing and they were NOT Royal Marines they were ARMY COMMANDO'S [Stirling was Scots Guards originally],The SAS arguably also has other co-founders and they were not just Scots men,it also worth noting the name SAS was already in use 11th SAS in North Africa ,this unit was a bluff however and also of note the SBS is actually older than the SAS by around one year lastly on this subject the Long Range Desert Group is also older than the SAS and with out its important intial help the SAS may not have survived,it was founded by Ralph Bagnold this is considered by some as the first modern Special Forces unit.

I also struck out the assertion Scotland invented the RAF ,this was no more scottish than English,perhaps to cite an individual but surely not "claiming it"Bullseye30 (talk) 15:35, 24 June 2014 (UTC)

First book in English in surgery

I don't think the assertion in this article can be correct as there was already a book by Thomas Gale (surgeon) (1507 - 1586) called "Certaine workes of chirurgie" published in 1563).-— Preceding unsigned comment added by Kinigi (talk • contribs) 09:23, 21 June 2010 (UTC)

The motion picture

I have removed the motion picture from the list. According to the given reference this is based upon William Kennedy Dickson - Dickson's claim to Scottishness is that his mother was of Scottish descent. Surely that is a bit tenuous? Certainly France, England and America could make an greater claim to him —Preceding unsigned comment added by Kinigi (talk • contribs) 18:31, 31 May 2010 (UTC)

Transistor

In what way exactly is the transistor a Scottish invention?-— Preceding unsigned comment added by 82.46.67.130 (talk) 16:42, 20 February 2007 (UTC)

In fairness, the mention is only in the first paragraph synopsis but is a bit misleading. I have removed it, it takes nothing away from the article as a whole. Finewinescotland 21:55, 26 June 2007 (UTC)

Name

Suggest that once the deletion vote has been concluded, that the article is renamed Scottish inventions and discoveries, in order to allow such things as the noble gases to be included. Astrotrain 21:36, 14 August 2006 (UTC)

Sounds reasonable. --Mais oui! 22:49, 14 August 2006 (UTC)

I suggest having two seperate lists - one for Scottish inventors, and one for things invented in Scotland. The current system invites redundancy with other similar lists such as English inventions.--Nydas 15:32, 26 August 2006 (UTC)

Citations

Seems a lot of citations are needed, I've started to put them in, most of the information is easily verifiable through respected websites. If anyone has an issue with the style or content of the citations please feel free to delete/change.Finewinescotland 00:12, 11 December 2006 (UTC)

Maxwell

Interesting that the entry on James Clark Maxwell is listed under Power Innovations. I would have placed him under Scientific Innovations where his contributions are much more widely attributed. (In fact he is often classed along with Newton and Einstein.) Also not sure why further citation is needed - the article on Maxwell himself is heavy with citations and is clear on his contribution. If there are no objections I will move his entry under Scientific Innovations. VJDocherty 10:03, 27 January 2007 (UTC)

Please do, and we would really appreciate it if you would add a couple of refs, as per WP:CITE - eg just nick some from the Maxwell article. All those bloody "citation needed" things are a complete style nightmare - all we need is a notice at the top. I'll sort that out (somebody went bananas on them a while ago). --Mais oui! 10:38, 27 January 2007 (UTC)

Really awkward sentence - anachronistic connection.

Near the top of the page, the following appears:

Even before the Industrial Revolution, Scots have been at the forefront of innovation and discovery across a wide range of spheres:

followed by a list of (mostly) post-industrial revolution inventions. This is an awful paragraph and I can't find a good way to correct it. Maybe it should just be deleted? Michael Daly 21:22, 18 October 2007 (UTC)

Basketball was invented & paraffin was discovered by Scotsmen?

Wasn't James Naismith, the inventor of basketball, a Canadian-born American of Scottish heritage?

Didn't Carl Reichenbach discover paraffin and the Scotsman credited in this page find a method of extracting it?

Reichenbach is cited as the inventor of Paraffin wax whereas James Young is credited with the extraction of Paraffin (oil) which in the US is known as Kerosene. There was a parallel development in the USA by Abraham Gesner who called it Kerosene. Young's product is reported as being superior and Young obtained UK and US patents which established his dominance in the market.79.78.90.93 (talk) 18:09, 9 December 2015 (UTC)

Radical new design of electrical generator - University of Edinburgh

• Scottish invention promises power revolution, The Times, 23 Nov 09

--Mais oui! (talk) 09:01, 23 November 2009 (UTC)

ATM?

The ATM was invented by two Scottish inventors. Which category would I put that in? Citation http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/newsbysector/banksandfinance/7743635/John-Shepherd-Barron-cash-machine-inventor-dies.html Jonbryce (talk) 13:37, 29 May 2010 (UTC)

Remove all uncited claims?

I already went through and removed all the uncited claims but have had my change reverted.

The majority of citation tags are marked as at least 6 months old but going by previous mention on the discussion page it looks like they are more likely several years old.

Clearly no one is motivated to add references by the presence of the citation tags so any uncited claims should be removed and only replaced once a proper reference has been provided, otherwise this article will remain in the horrible unreferenced mess it has clearly been in for years.

"If a claim is doubtful but not harmful, use the tag, which will add "citation needed," but remember to go back and remove the claim if no source is produced within a reasonable time."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Citing_sources#Dealing_with_unsourced_material

Muleattack (talk) 19:17, 8 June 2010 (UTC)

• Oppose Removal of so much material would be contrary to our editing policy. In most cases, there are blue links and the corresponding articles support the claims made here. Per WP:TAGBOMB, we should reserve citation needed tags for the most dubious cases - those with red links say. I expect that these too will stand up when we examine them. Let's start by looking at the first: Samuel Brown - a pioneer of suspension bridge engineering. One immediately finds, by searching that the red link can be fixed up to Samuel Brown (Royal Navy officer) and so the entry is supported. This is the way to proceed. Colonel Warden (talk) 20:24, 8 June 2010 (UTC)

Flush toilet?

it was invented by John Harrington 200 years before. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.144.67.47 (talk) 16:54, 29 May 2011 (UTC)

The wealth of nations by Adam Smith

I have reverted the edit by the user Muelattack in good faith. He states was the wealth of Nations by adam smith was removed beacause it was neither an invention or discovery? Smiths magnus opus was certainly a publishing first, a discovery on his part in modern economic theory and its influence cannot be underestimated. It is a reflection on economics at the beginning of the Industrial Revolution and argues that free market economies are more productive and beneficial to their societies. The book is a fundamental work in classical economics, therefore setting its foundation. In the words of George Stigler attributes to Smith "the most important substantive proposition in all of economics and foundation of resource-allocation theory".

It certainly is a world publishing first and Smith founded modern ecconomics in this work. Other Scottish publishing firsts are included in the article so why not this one and other pages such as the English inventions and discoveries includes publishing firsts such as the first book printed in English which is neither an invention or discovery as both the printing press and English language pre-date the first printed book. Smiths work is a groundbreaking work in modern economic theory and therefore should be included.Uthican (talk) 12:12, 1 January 2012 (UTC)

Incorrect, I reverted your addition because it had no citations. I asked this to be discussed and thank you for starting the discussion. I'm not confident that it counts as an invention or discovery and we should see what other editors think. I have also removed your addition again as it has no citations. Muleattack (talk) 12:26, 1 January 2012 (UTC)

thank you for the response and I have looked into several citations that can be used to justify the placement of Smith's theories in the article. Citations like "On The wealth of Nations books that changed the world by P. J. O'Rourke Grove Press 2007" recognizes smiths work as "the" fundamental work of economics, as important to the development of this field as Darwin's The Origin of Species would be for natural history eighty years later. Darwin is included in English inventions and discoveries and Smiths theories are that groundbreaking.

Other works like "Short Course in International Economics Understanding the Dynamics of the Global Marketplace by Jeffrey E. Curry p4 world trade press" states; Smith was the "founder of classical economics and that the wealth of nations remains a standard text for economics students world wide". The invention of classical economics is attributed to Smith this should be added to the page economists rank his theories as the equivalent of the theories of Charles Darwin. He should at least have a mention as the principle founder of classical economics and the impact his work has on the diciplin. Regards. Uthican (talk) 16:10, 1 January 2012 (UTC)

Would the the industrialization and modernization of a country count

Just read that Thomas Blake Glover was one of the key founders of industrialization and modernization of Japan would this count? He also founded the Kirin Beer Company surly the the industrialization and modernization of a nation would bare a mention?Uthican (talk) 19:19, 12 February 2012 (UTC)

What would it be listed as? Muleattack (talk) 00:22, 13 February 2012 (UTC)

At the very least an innovation there's a category for it. kind regardsUthican (talk) 01:36, 14 February 2012 (UTC)

Ah, didn't realise you had already added it, was just wondering how it was going to be worded. Muleattack (talk) 07:47, 14 February 2012 (UTC)

First electricity by wind power

Should this be on there? The world's first-known structure by which electricity was generated from wind power. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prof_James_Blyth — Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.63.50.134 (talk) 23:58, 30 March 2014 (UTC)

Focus

I think this article should draw more attention to the television and telephone, those being imo the most culturally significant and well known devices,

Perhaps move their section to the top, and them to the top of it? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 82.69.100.180 (talk) 22:27, 13 September 2014 (UTC)

U.S. Navy creator

I removed "United States Navy: Created largely by John Paul Jones, who was born in Kirkcudbrightshire." because there are no sources and no statements to support this in the linked articles. This content was restored today without explanation and without any supporting sources. Rather than engage in edit war let's discuss this here (or simply locate the required sources!). Jojalozzo 15:03, 14 September 2014 (UTC)

Safetray - self-promotion??

The Miscellaneous innovations section is likely to become the longest section in Wikipedia if every new Scottish gadget is listed. The Safetray entry seems to be self-promotion. The wiki entry for Safetray is very comprehensive and, considering it is a plastic clip which has only sold a few thousand units, it is hardly appropriate for a Wiki entry on inventions and discoveries listed in the same section as the Bank of England and colour photography and would open the floodgates for every product designer/inventor in Scotland to add their own product.79.78.90.93 (talk) 18:53, 9 December 2015 (UTC)

First Strike Team

Hi. Thought I would try to find proof of the military tactic of using a small team to strike against a larger force as a Scottish innovation. There is lots of proof that the SAS are derived from the Scottish Highlanders, which was their speciality, but I'd of liked to go back further to the Romans and the Picts/Gael-Scots, with the Scots either use or even invention of Guerilla warfare, I realize there are others with this claim, Sun Tzu The Art of War mentions guerilla tactics, but not a strike team. any help would be appreciated.

Dava4444 (talk) 19:02, 17 May 2017 (UTC)

Lawnmower

There seems to be a discrepancy over the invention of the lawnmower, it appears under "English Inventions", too, with a different inventor. — Preceding unsigned comment added by RoyalNW1 (talk • contribs) 16:50, 23 July 2019 (UTC)

Now, Let Me Get This Straight...

So, if a Russian, Bulgarian, French, English, Spanish or Welsh person invents something in Scotland, that is a Scottish invention? Oh dear. And then if somebody invents something in France, but they have a Scottish grandfather, that is also a Scottish invention? The whole subject of Scots seems to have been hijacked by some vey odd and illogical people on Wikipedia. It smacks of something vaguely racist and very imperialist. Who is reviewing this page? I find myself agreeing with this article: https://britishcelticnations.blogspot.com/2020/08/the-highly-inclusive-ancient-brits-and.html

(86.177.162.228 (talk) 10:40, 14 August 2020 (UTC))