Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Taylor Stanton

The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was delete. Wizardman 15:52, 7 May 2013 (UTC)

Taylor Stanton

Taylor Stanton (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View log · Stats)

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Non-notable minor league baseball player. Prod removed with the note "Remove PROD designation. Signed with AA Redhawks who issued press release today". This is not a valid reason for us not to delete this article. The Fargo-Moorhead Redhawks are an independent team and Stanton does not have sufficient reliable sources to establish notability. – Muboshgu (talk) 00:26, 1 May 2013 (UTC)

Stanton has played several years in the Mariners system. The American Association of Independent Professional Baseball is a viable component of entertainment in non-MLB cities such as Fargo, and the League continues to send pitchers notably, to the majors. Stanton had more than 100 innings pitched in each of the past 3 seasons. Were he out of baseball, deletion would be in order. His signing makes that premature unless we class Independent Leagues as lacking notability. The inclusion of the American Association as a page would seem to infer otherwise. --Wineshark (talk) 01:56, 1 May 2013 (UTC)

Note: This debate has been included in the list of Sportspeople-related deletion discussions. – Muboshgu (talk) 00:27, 1 May 2013 (UTC)

Note: This debate has been included in the list of Baseball-related deletion discussions. – Muboshgu (talk) 00:27, 1 May 2013 (UTC)

• Delete per nom. Fails WP:BASE/N and WP:GNG. Clarityfiend (talk) 05:08, 1 May 2013 (UTC)
• Delete per nom. Despite what Wineshark says above, players in the independent leagues are not notable even though the league itself is. Spanneraol (talk) 19:45, 1 May 2013 (UTC)

Indented line

Appreciate the comments. This is my first time even trying to use Wikipedia for something other than research. I'm a writer, blogger, researcher, speaker, and an economist by trade. So call me an educated user but one lacking the nuances of this community. I just know if I ran this platform, I would delete pages with dated information or useless information - neither of which would be brand positive for Wikipedia. Data sanitation is a needed element in any database and if this is judged as useless information, then I understand. In this case however, if someone (like me) were going to keep the page current, I'd suggest that's precisely what Wiki is looking for; people to engage and provide potentially useful content. An example of how the content can be useful is the article in the RedHawks team site . The picture, if not some of the facts in the article was taken from Wiki and the background photoshopped. In this next season as fans look for information on the player, they will find no location on the web where they can find everything that's included here.

Before you ask, I am not related. I'm not paid for this either but I do know Taylor well. I'm just trying to help get his digital profile enhanced a little so people can find information when they want it.

The Mariners have one of, if not the deepest minor league staff in baseball. Getting released in the final cut is a blow but not crippling. He was encouraged by Mariners management to stick with it when he was released. Other teams have shown interest in signing him since, but the time to make a decision was last Friday. If I had to guess based on what I know, his contract will be purchased mid-season by a MLB team. None of that is relevelt for debate because there is no source to cite in any of it. I'm offering it only as background and would ask you to please leave the page up for the year and let Taylor's situation play out. Its a small favor to ask. Thanks. // --Wineshark (talk) 21:16, 1 May 2013 (UTC)

Lots of people play in the minor leagues, doing so by itself does not satisfy the baseball notability requirements of WP:BASE/N. In order to show he satisfies the requirements of WP:GNG you need to show more substantial coverage of him from reliable sources. The current sources in the article are team sites and stat sites... which arent enough.. he needs substantial profiles in credible media. Also, you seem to have a WP:COI problem. You are not supposed to write articles about people you personally know and your desire to " help get his digital profile enhanced" is a perfect example of what wikipedia is not supposed to be used for. Spanneraol (talk) 22:03, 1 May 2013 (UTC)

• Again forgive my ignorance as a newbie, but as I read , the writing is to be in a neutral point of view versus a prohibition against writing on something or someone for which you have knowledge. The counter to your point if true, means only people ignorant of a subject or person can contribute. The reality is somewhere in the middle in that we all have bias, but hopefully write about that in which we are interested and have understanding. I don't believe any of my edits have been in anything but a neutral voice. I can't speak to a community view of notoriety or relevance as that's a gauge that is understood over time in the community and opinions will vary.--Wineshark (talk) 01:17, 2 May 2013 (UTC)

• The writing appears neutral to me, so that's not the problem. People with a COI aren't forbidden from working on that article, but they are discouraged from it. The COI in this case isn't manifesting itself with POV, but with the existence of this article against notability guidelines. – Muboshgu (talk) 13:25, 2 May 2013 (UTC)

• I can live with a judgement that this article isn't notable. That standard isn't something I am capable of defending being new to this part of Wiki. But if this isn't notable, I would suggest that there are numerous minor league players in a similar situation that are occupying similar digital space, with the only difference being they are on a farm team for a MLB team. Example: San Diego Padres minor league players There are obviously many more examples but they all share the same characteristic of lacking substantial coverage from reliable sources and or only including references from team and stat sites. So perhaps the situation isn't player specific at all, but the idea that the only players of note are in the farm systems of affilliated ML clubs? That seems to have been the defining moment at which time this player was nominated for deletion.

Would it help if the independent league rosters were added to the team sites in the American Association of Independent Professional Baseball pages, to mirror those found in San Diego Padres minor league players to use a specific example? Would merging this player on to a team page resolve the seeming discrepancy?--Wineshark (talk) 19:50, 2 May 2013 (UTC)

• I don't see any discrepancy.. The consensus has been that players on MLB farm teams have more notability than those on independent league teams as such players are usually players that have washed out of affiliated leagues or weren't good enough in the first place. The players on those minor league player pages aren't notable enough to have their own pages, but as top prospects in the MLB team's system they are notable as a group. No reason to create list pages for AA teams as those rosters turn over faster than affiliated teams.Spanneraol (talk) 22:05, 2 May 2013 (UTC)
• The discrepancy exists. The original reason for deletion was a lack of "sufficient reliable sources to establish notability." I pointed out players in ML farm teams who have the same lack of sufficient reliable sources to establish notability - but aren't slated for deletion. It's OK with me if the community has as a rule that no independent player can qualify for a page, and only MLB minor leagues receive a pass on the guideline requiring sufficient reliable sources to establish notability, but I don't see that mentioned? Perhaps deleting players who drop off a MLB farm team is a common practice, but it doesn't appear as a guideline as far as I can tell. In view of the grey area - I'd respectfully ask to leave this player up for another year. Its not a large ask.--Wineshark (talk) 17:20, 6 May 2013 (UTC)

Players on ML farm teams also need sufficient sources to establish notability for their own individual pages, thus no discrepancy. You were referring to the minor league list pages earlier and AA teams arent sufficiently notable to have such a list page while Major League teams are. The standards for inclusion as part of a list is different than for a stand alone article. Spanneraol (talk) 17:42, 6 May 2013 (UTC)

• Yes. Thank you. That is my point. While not posted anywhere as a guideline as far as I can tell, the community or at least those responding to this discussion, seem to have adopted the belief that Indy teams "arent sufficiently notable to have such a list page while Major League teams are." I had suggested above a willingness to merge this player into a team list matching those of ML farm teams as a solution and another way in which to make this work, consistent with the Deletion Policy; specifically the section on alternatives to deletions.--Wineshark (talk) 21:37, 6 May 2013 (UTC)
• Delete Non-notable minor league baseball player. Alex (talk) 22:52, 6 May 2013 (UTC)
• It appears the debate has taken its course and so ready for a Mod to make a final call. Thank you for listening.--Wineshark (talk) 23:31, 6 May 2013 (UTC)

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.